Preparation for contributor marketing push #830
Comments
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My stances:
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A marketing push would be wonderful. Hopefully that'll get evlp-v2 out the door and more people working on winit/glutin. (I'd be really happy if we had more people working the non-linux platforms for glutin, as I feel they're being left to suffer to bit rot)
I don't think an automated mechanism would solve this issue of bugs sitting inactive for forever. We don't have that many people, and no one (at least I don't) wants to go too far back in the pile of bug reports, because that requires trying to figure out if bugs are still relevant. For example let's take #391 (chosen randomly, cause I liked it's name). It's related to #1033, whose latest comment says #1033 is no-longer reproducible, and #574, which was fixed. Is #391 still reproducible? Maybe, I don't have a windows rig to test if it still is, and given there is an other ~100 old issues like it, I don't think anyone's going to be testing it any time soon. Just going through the issues someday and checking if they're still relevant would probably shutdown ~20% Second: can we be at least tagging issues by platform? Only 10 of the 25 issues on the first page have any tags at all. It would be nice to be able to sort by platform :) I'd be willing to do both task, if required.
Yes please. Glutin now uses this hack for EDIT: Can will we add glutin to this organization? I hope so.
Isn't that
I don't see why not. A massive single point of failure might be a concern, however, I think we can combat this by striving for 2, or more, maintainers per platform. That way, if someone goes MIA, we still have some else.
I think it should be okay to delist her, after getting her permission. Till then, no harm having a second maintainer for those platforms. |
I'd take this question on the over way. I don't see any fundamental issue with one person being maintainer of more than one platform, but I think it'd be better to have more than one maintainer per platform. As a personal example, I think it is quite obvious that the set of people programming in Rust and very familiar with Wayland is, well, pretty small. A few years ago I accidentally became a maintainer of winit, because I contributed a Wayland backend to it while my primary intention was to use this backend to battle-test my Wayland bindings. 😅 Still I see that winit and Wayland-related support to downstream crates takes up a large portion of my open-source time, and I really would prefer to share that burden. As I've said several times, I'd be quite happy to mentor anyone interested with how Wayland works, but it looks like not many persons are interested by it at all. 🤷♂️
As said previously, I believe we need more than one point of contact per platform anyway. And I guess if she does not have any more time to devote to winit, it may make sense to only display her as Contributor/Reviewer (whatever we call it) so that people don't try to contact her first. But I'd not change her status without her approval.
Do you mean something similar to what the rust repo does? A bot that automatically assigns issues to a random contributor, which is then responsible for tagging the issue appropriately and reassigning it to a more relevant person if necessary? If so, why not, but that would only make sense once we have a large enough number of contributors in my opinion.
I don't have a strong opinion wrt to that.
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re:ZeGentzy & vberger - I'd agree that this is a later-stage action to take, once we've built up enough contributors that all issues aren't randomly assigned to a single person. Also, we probably should only do it for new issues, than manually triage old issues (which we desperately need to do!). re:vberger - yeah, that's roughly what I mean. When we do it, I'd also like to set up a system to allow issue submitters to automatically tag a particular platform so that issues get randomly assigned to a contributor to that platform.
My gut feeling is that how the position is named changes how people behave - if it's just "Reviewer", that implies that the only responsibility is reviewing other peoples' PRs, while "Contributor" implies more actively tackling issues. It also more clearly communicates the intent of can be assigned to investigate platform-specific issues. I don't know how well that feeling translates to reality, though.
That's my gut feeling too, but my concern is that keeping her listed as maintainer will result in bad experiences for new people contributing to those platforms - if she's listed as the maintainer, it makes sense for new contributors to ask her to review changes, but since she's unable to do so she won't. The solution is either downgrading her status from maintainer or delisting her, and I've asked her about doing that, but I haven't gotten a response in over a week. I don't want to wait forever for her to officially update her status if she isn't intending to do it.
That's the hope of the marketing push :D! We haven't gotten a whole lot of people offering to help, but we also haven't been asking for it, and we have enough people using Winit (looking at the stats, we get almost 900 downloads per day!) that that'll likely change once we start more aggressive outreach.
Yeah, getting glutin under the new organization is the intent. I've created the
I feel there's enough difference between Winit/Glutin and Glium to put them under different organizations. |
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@tomaka Could you transfer this repository, glutin, and android-glue over to EDIT: And give crates.io ownership rights to the members of those organizations? |
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@tomaka ? |
…ng#830 This includes de-listing @francesca64 from the table, as I suggested. I realize that this is a controversial decision, and it's not a decision I make lightly, but I believe I have justification for doing so: I contacted @francesca64 last month asking her about her inactivity as a maintainer on this project. She replied on March 26th as follows. For the sake of her privacy, I've removed removed certain sections of her response, as it contains some personal details that I'm not comfortable sharing with the world at large without her explicit permission. > Hello! Thanks for reaching out!❤ > In short, I've moved on. <removed> ...in November, I was hired by a > company that recently started using Rust. I'm very happily building > infrastructure there! > I'm simply not interested in spending more than 8 hours a day > programming. You couldn't even pay me to do it! My time is best spent > going on adventures with my beloved. > I'll still be active in the Rust ecosystem, but only insofar as the > company I work for is. We use winit on iOS, Android, and (to a limited > extent) macOS, so I'll work on those backends as needed. > Thank you for taking care of winit. I hope you're taking care of > yourself too; <removed>. I don't begrudge her for her decision, and others shouldn't either - I firmly believe that, as this is unpaid, volunteer work, everybody should have the right to move on when they decide they no longer have the time or will to contribute. The exact impliciation of this in regards to her status as maintainer is open to interpretation. I would argue that this means, should she in her work stumble upon an issue in any of her listed backends, she would be willing to submit PRs addressing those issues. However, it also means that she is not able to put in the time to be active as a maintainer on those platforms, or review PRs and issues for those platforms. On March 28th I responded to her email as follows: > Hey, thanks for responding. > <removed, personal details> > In the meanwhile, there are still a few loose ends from your time as > maintainer that I'd like to get cleaned up. It's okay if you aren't > going to be spending much time on Winit, but there's still a broad > assumption that you're able to review PRs for them and that doesn't seem > to be the case. Would you be able to do a couple things to ease the > transition to whoever next takes over the macOS, X11, and Android > backends? > 1) Submit a PR downgrading yourself from maintainer for macOS, X11, and > Android, so somebody else can more actively take them over. > 2) Post your WIP macOS backend for EL2.0 as well as the issues it > currently has, so whoever next maintains macOS can finish it. > Going forward, I'd like to reach out to the broader Rust community and > find more active maintainers so Winit can get to 1.0 and I can mostly > move on from it. I recieved no response to that email. On April 4th, I followed up on that email: > If you aren't able to act as a maintainer for Winit, and aren't able to > submit a PR updating your official status as maintainer to reflect > reality, would you mind if I submitted a PR removing you as maintainer? > That's not something I want to do since it's a bad image for me, a bad > image for Winit, and sets an extremely uncomfortable precedent, but I'd > like to start more aggressive outreach to ensure each backend is less > dependent on one specific person and I don't want to see new > contributors pinging you for help when you're unable to provide it. > If you don't reply by the 11th that's the path I'm going to take, but I > consider it the nuclear option and I want to avoid invoking it if at all > possible. Up to this date (April 13th), I have recieved no response. Given the amount of time I've given her to respond, as well as her lack of response, I believe we have the justification to remove her from the table. Should she show back up again, any clarifications on her status would be welcome, and she is welcome to submit a PR re-listing herself on the table with a more accurate description of her current contributor status. However, once we begin the contributor marketing push discussed in rust-windowing#830, I don't want new contributors to attempt to ask her questions on the macOS, X11, or Android backends when she isn't able to give a response. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- This PR also introduces HALL_OF_CHAMPIONS.md, which commends the efforts of former maintainers that have contributed greatly to the Winit project. This wasn't discussed previously, but I think it's important to recognize the people that brought us to where we are today. It currently lists @tomaka and @francesca64, as they are the two individuals I'm aware of that both deserve such recognition and no longer actively contribute to Winit, but if there's anybody I missed feel free to suggest them and a blurb describing their work.
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@tomaka has been MIA for a long while: rust-windowing/glutin#1114 (comment) |
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He's active on GitHub at least, so we know he's not dead. I'm assuming he's just muted these repositories, so I'll drop him an email and see if he responds there. |
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Hah, that's exactly the name that I was thinking of when I started reading this issue :) . A different suggestion regarding @francesca64: Keep her listed, but also explicitly state that she is "currently [ not active in / absent from ] this project as of April 2019 and might take a while to respond", or something like that, e.g. as a footnote. |
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About me: I've been here a few months ago doing some experimental stuff, getting started with both Rust and graphics programming. I'm currently picking that up again with a focus on learning Vulkan (and maybe gfx-rs / wgpu). I don't want to promise anything, but should that path continue, I can see myself contributing to winit in some way (other than half-OT commenting on issues) in the future. About outreach: I'm regularly checking out https://this-week-in-rust.org/ – once this "contributor preparation" is finished, make sure to get listed there! Also, I'm listening to various podcasts from around the ecosystem, such as https://newrustacean.com/ (still making progress). Someone who's been working on winit a few months might reach out to Chris for making an interview, especially as it seems he's working on a cross-platform GUI app himself: https://twitter.com/chriskrycho/status/1114696179042869249. |
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(Hoping to get to Also potentially worth checking out related to this issue (I haven't listened to them, but seen their titles) are several podcasts of https://changelog.com/podcast on maintaining / sustaining / funding open source projects. Edit: Alright, before I post anything more, I'll see about setting up these chat clients :) |
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Sorry, I tend to ignore/disable notifications from GitHub because they pile up too quickly (I've got 70 notifications at the moment for example). I'm definitely in favour of a move to a |
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For what it's worth, I'm not really a fan of creating teams of people depending on their platform. This feels a bit too bureaucratic. But if you think it's the right approach, then whatever works! |
I'm not familiar with github teams, but it appears there are some communication facilities for teams? I guess this may be useful from a purely practical perspective. |
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The main reason teams intrigued me was that they seem to add an easy way to ping everybody that can work on a given backend, but unfortunately there doesn't seem to be any way to make them visible to non-members (which seems weird, but I didn't see any options!). Listing the project's organization in a non-public place is a no-go for me, so I'm not inclined to keep looking at them for now, but they're something to consider revisiting if a more ad-hoc organization method ends up not working in the long run. |
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You can only give ownership of a crate on crates.io to a specific team in an organization, so I've created a "Publishers" team with the intent of giving the rights to publish. |
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Alright, I've given you owner privileges in the organization. You should be good to go now. |
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Will the travis build need some reconfiguration following the ownership change, to continue auto-publishing new releases? |
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Normally no. |
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How do I add these five crates to rust-windowing? |
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@zegentzy |
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"error: failed to invite owners to crate glutin_egl_sys: api errors (status 200 OK): only members of a team can add it as an owner" |
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You probably have to make yourself member of "Publishers". |
This includes de-listing @francesca64 from the table, as I suggested. I realize that this is a controversial decision, and it's not a decision I make lightly, but I believe I have justification for doing so: I contacted @francesca64 last month asking her about her inactivity as a maintainer on this project. She replied on March 26th as follows. For the sake of her privacy, I've removed removed certain sections of her response, as it contains some personal details that I'm not comfortable sharing with the world at large without her explicit permission. > Hello! Thanks for reaching out!❤ > In short, I've moved on. <removed> ...in November, I was hired by a > company that recently started using Rust. I'm very happily building > infrastructure there! > I'm simply not interested in spending more than 8 hours a day > programming. You couldn't even pay me to do it! My time is best spent > going on adventures with my beloved. > I'll still be active in the Rust ecosystem, but only insofar as the > company I work for is. We use winit on iOS, Android, and (to a limited > extent) macOS, so I'll work on those backends as needed. > Thank you for taking care of winit. I hope you're taking care of > yourself too; <removed>. I don't begrudge her for her decision, and others shouldn't either - I firmly believe that, as this is unpaid, volunteer work, everybody should have the right to move on when they decide they no longer have the time or will to contribute. The exact impliciation of this in regards to her status as maintainer is open to interpretation. I would argue that this means, should she in her work stumble upon an issue in any of her listed backends, she would be willing to submit PRs addressing those issues. However, it also means that she is not able to put in the time to be active as a maintainer on those platforms, or review PRs and issues for those platforms. On March 28th I responded to her email as follows: > Hey, thanks for responding. > <removed, personal details> > In the meanwhile, there are still a few loose ends from your time as > maintainer that I'd like to get cleaned up. It's okay if you aren't > going to be spending much time on Winit, but there's still a broad > assumption that you're able to review PRs for them and that doesn't seem > to be the case. Would you be able to do a couple things to ease the > transition to whoever next takes over the macOS, X11, and Android > backends? > 1) Submit a PR downgrading yourself from maintainer for macOS, X11, and > Android, so somebody else can more actively take them over. > 2) Post your WIP macOS backend for EL2.0 as well as the issues it > currently has, so whoever next maintains macOS can finish it. > Going forward, I'd like to reach out to the broader Rust community and > find more active maintainers so Winit can get to 1.0 and I can mostly > move on from it. I recieved no response to that email. On April 4th, I followed up on that email: > If you aren't able to act as a maintainer for Winit, and aren't able to > submit a PR updating your official status as maintainer to reflect > reality, would you mind if I submitted a PR removing you as maintainer? > That's not something I want to do since it's a bad image for me, a bad > image for Winit, and sets an extremely uncomfortable precedent, but I'd > like to start more aggressive outreach to ensure each backend is less > dependent on one specific person and I don't want to see new > contributors pinging you for help when you're unable to provide it. > If you don't reply by the 11th that's the path I'm going to take, but I > consider it the nuclear option and I want to avoid invoking it if at all > possible. Up to this date (April 13th), I have recieved no response. Given the amount of time I've given her to respond, as well as her lack of response, I believe we have the justification to remove her from the table. Should she show back up again, any clarifications on her status would be welcome, and she is welcome to submit a PR re-listing herself on the table with a more accurate description of her current contributor status. However, once we begin the contributor marketing push discussed in #830, I don't want new contributors to attempt to ask her questions on the macOS, X11, or Android backends when she isn't able to give a response. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- This PR also introduces HALL_OF_CHAMPIONS.md, which commends the efforts of former maintainers that have contributed greatly to the Winit project. This wasn't discussed previously, but I think it's important to recognize the people that brought us to where we are today. It currently lists @tomaka and @francesca64, as they are the two individuals I'm aware of that both deserve such recognition and no longer actively contribute to Winit, but if there's anybody I missed feel free to suggest them and a blurb describing their work.
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Do we have anything still blocking the actual launch of the marketing push? |
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I don't believe so! I just need to write a short summary of what sort of help we want - I'll write that up and post a draft here tonight. Sorry about the delay - I haven't had a whole lot of free time in the past week or so. That's been somewhat my fault though, and I've been working on rebalancing my schedule to give myself more time for hobbyist work, so I should have more time going forward! |
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Triaging pass done! I've compiled a list of the issues we can ask people for help on here. That's missing some links and has some WIP comments, but it should be a good start. I was meaning to write the actual help request after getting that list together, but going through all the issues took way longer than I expected and I honestly don't have the energy to do more writing right now. I'll definitely pull it together tomorrow, though. |
…ng#830 (rust-windowing#841) This includes de-listing @francesca64 from the table, as I suggested. I realize that this is a controversial decision, and it's not a decision I make lightly, but I believe I have justification for doing so: I contacted @francesca64 last month asking her about her inactivity as a maintainer on this project. She replied on March 26th as follows. For the sake of her privacy, I've removed removed certain sections of her response, as it contains some personal details that I'm not comfortable sharing with the world at large without her explicit permission. > Hello! Thanks for reaching out!❤ > In short, I've moved on. <removed> ...in November, I was hired by a > company that recently started using Rust. I'm very happily building > infrastructure there! > I'm simply not interested in spending more than 8 hours a day > programming. You couldn't even pay me to do it! My time is best spent > going on adventures with my beloved. > I'll still be active in the Rust ecosystem, but only insofar as the > company I work for is. We use winit on iOS, Android, and (to a limited > extent) macOS, so I'll work on those backends as needed. > Thank you for taking care of winit. I hope you're taking care of > yourself too; <removed>. I don't begrudge her for her decision, and others shouldn't either - I firmly believe that, as this is unpaid, volunteer work, everybody should have the right to move on when they decide they no longer have the time or will to contribute. The exact impliciation of this in regards to her status as maintainer is open to interpretation. I would argue that this means, should she in her work stumble upon an issue in any of her listed backends, she would be willing to submit PRs addressing those issues. However, it also means that she is not able to put in the time to be active as a maintainer on those platforms, or review PRs and issues for those platforms. On March 28th I responded to her email as follows: > Hey, thanks for responding. > <removed, personal details> > In the meanwhile, there are still a few loose ends from your time as > maintainer that I'd like to get cleaned up. It's okay if you aren't > going to be spending much time on Winit, but there's still a broad > assumption that you're able to review PRs for them and that doesn't seem > to be the case. Would you be able to do a couple things to ease the > transition to whoever next takes over the macOS, X11, and Android > backends? > 1) Submit a PR downgrading yourself from maintainer for macOS, X11, and > Android, so somebody else can more actively take them over. > 2) Post your WIP macOS backend for EL2.0 as well as the issues it > currently has, so whoever next maintains macOS can finish it. > Going forward, I'd like to reach out to the broader Rust community and > find more active maintainers so Winit can get to 1.0 and I can mostly > move on from it. I recieved no response to that email. On April 4th, I followed up on that email: > If you aren't able to act as a maintainer for Winit, and aren't able to > submit a PR updating your official status as maintainer to reflect > reality, would you mind if I submitted a PR removing you as maintainer? > That's not something I want to do since it's a bad image for me, a bad > image for Winit, and sets an extremely uncomfortable precedent, but I'd > like to start more aggressive outreach to ensure each backend is less > dependent on one specific person and I don't want to see new > contributors pinging you for help when you're unable to provide it. > If you don't reply by the 11th that's the path I'm going to take, but I > consider it the nuclear option and I want to avoid invoking it if at all > possible. Up to this date (April 13th), I have recieved no response. Given the amount of time I've given her to respond, as well as her lack of response, I believe we have the justification to remove her from the table. Should she show back up again, any clarifications on her status would be welcome, and she is welcome to submit a PR re-listing herself on the table with a more accurate description of her current contributor status. However, once we begin the contributor marketing push discussed in rust-windowing#830, I don't want new contributors to attempt to ask her questions on the macOS, X11, or Android backends when she isn't able to give a response. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- This PR also introduces HALL_OF_CHAMPIONS.md, which commends the efforts of former maintainers that have contributed greatly to the Winit project. This wasn't discussed previously, but I think it's important to recognize the people that brought us to where we are today. It currently lists @tomaka and @francesca64, as they are the two individuals I'm aware of that both deserve such recognition and no longer actively contribute to Winit, but if there's anybody I missed feel free to suggest them and a blurb describing their work.
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Not particularly timely, but I've got a first draft: https://gist.github.com/Osspial/1a93d599189f49a97884c4aa033e9ef3 I'm not entirely happy with that, for various reasons (off the top of my head, though there are undoubtedly more):
I'll work on that more later, but in the meantime any additional feedback is much appreciated. |
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Minor typo:
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@Osspial Can we add the following to the list of tasks: Windows: Linux X11: Linux Wayland: iOS: Android: Macos: Emscripten: Meta: EDIT: And of course, the things on my milestone list: https://github.com/rust-windowing/glutin/milestone/2 |
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Linux X11: |
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Since triaging is such a calming task, I've went through and marked issues that I think are good first issues as such. |
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Hey, quick update on where I stand on this, since the actual help wanted post is ready to go: I'd like to get the |
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I'm trying to finish up a prototype application (been working on it for weeks already) using the legacy event loop, with the intent of immediately porting it over to the new event loop once I get it working. Then (hopefully soon) I should be able to provide some feedback on eventloop-2.0 on macOS 10.13. |
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At this point I'm tempted to just leave #895 where it is and release regardless, since it seems pretty unlikely that it'll get merged before we have someone that can handle macOS. |
Does this mean merge I think the X11 backend needs some work. My simple examples were suffering from lost events. See also #865 |
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I'd suggest merging the eventloop-2.0 branch (or replacing master with it and moving master into a This way we can release a version that people can easily depend on for battle testing and bugfixes and start attempting to port their applications, while it remains clear that the new winit is not yet polished. It can then serve as a stepping stone for the marketing push ("help us find the remaining bugs and fix them !"). What do you think? |
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@vberger That sounds great! I can handle doing the branch juggling (and maybe deleting most of the old, unused branches still in this repo) tonight. |
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Branch juggling has been completed, and PRs have been updated to be against their proper branches. |
…ng#830 (rust-windowing#841) This includes de-listing @francesca64 from the table, as I suggested. I realize that this is a controversial decision, and it's not a decision I make lightly, but I believe I have justification for doing so: I contacted @francesca64 last month asking her about her inactivity as a maintainer on this project. She replied on March 26th as follows. For the sake of her privacy, I've removed removed certain sections of her response, as it contains some personal details that I'm not comfortable sharing with the world at large without her explicit permission. > Hello! Thanks for reaching out!❤ > In short, I've moved on. <removed> ...in November, I was hired by a > company that recently started using Rust. I'm very happily building > infrastructure there! > I'm simply not interested in spending more than 8 hours a day > programming. You couldn't even pay me to do it! My time is best spent > going on adventures with my beloved. > I'll still be active in the Rust ecosystem, but only insofar as the > company I work for is. We use winit on iOS, Android, and (to a limited > extent) macOS, so I'll work on those backends as needed. > Thank you for taking care of winit. I hope you're taking care of > yourself too; <removed>. I don't begrudge her for her decision, and others shouldn't either - I firmly believe that, as this is unpaid, volunteer work, everybody should have the right to move on when they decide they no longer have the time or will to contribute. The exact impliciation of this in regards to her status as maintainer is open to interpretation. I would argue that this means, should she in her work stumble upon an issue in any of her listed backends, she would be willing to submit PRs addressing those issues. However, it also means that she is not able to put in the time to be active as a maintainer on those platforms, or review PRs and issues for those platforms. On March 28th I responded to her email as follows: > Hey, thanks for responding. > <removed, personal details> > In the meanwhile, there are still a few loose ends from your time as > maintainer that I'd like to get cleaned up. It's okay if you aren't > going to be spending much time on Winit, but there's still a broad > assumption that you're able to review PRs for them and that doesn't seem > to be the case. Would you be able to do a couple things to ease the > transition to whoever next takes over the macOS, X11, and Android > backends? > 1) Submit a PR downgrading yourself from maintainer for macOS, X11, and > Android, so somebody else can more actively take them over. > 2) Post your WIP macOS backend for EL2.0 as well as the issues it > currently has, so whoever next maintains macOS can finish it. > Going forward, I'd like to reach out to the broader Rust community and > find more active maintainers so Winit can get to 1.0 and I can mostly > move on from it. I recieved no response to that email. On April 4th, I followed up on that email: > If you aren't able to act as a maintainer for Winit, and aren't able to > submit a PR updating your official status as maintainer to reflect > reality, would you mind if I submitted a PR removing you as maintainer? > That's not something I want to do since it's a bad image for me, a bad > image for Winit, and sets an extremely uncomfortable precedent, but I'd > like to start more aggressive outreach to ensure each backend is less > dependent on one specific person and I don't want to see new > contributors pinging you for help when you're unable to provide it. > If you don't reply by the 11th that's the path I'm going to take, but I > consider it the nuclear option and I want to avoid invoking it if at all > possible. Up to this date (April 13th), I have recieved no response. Given the amount of time I've given her to respond, as well as her lack of response, I believe we have the justification to remove her from the table. Should she show back up again, any clarifications on her status would be welcome, and she is welcome to submit a PR re-listing herself on the table with a more accurate description of her current contributor status. However, once we begin the contributor marketing push discussed in rust-windowing#830, I don't want new contributors to attempt to ask her questions on the macOS, X11, or Android backends when she isn't able to give a response. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- This PR also introduces HALL_OF_CHAMPIONS.md, which commends the efforts of former maintainers that have contributed greatly to the Winit project. This wasn't discussed previously, but I think it's important to recognize the people that brought us to where we are today. It currently lists @tomaka and @francesca64, as they are the two individuals I'm aware of that both deserve such recognition and no longer actively contribute to Winit, but if there's anybody I missed feel free to suggest them and a blurb describing their work.
…ng#830 (rust-windowing#841) This includes de-listing @francesca64 from the table, as I suggested. I realize that this is a controversial decision, and it's not a decision I make lightly, but I believe I have justification for doing so: I contacted @francesca64 last month asking her about her inactivity as a maintainer on this project. She replied on March 26th as follows. For the sake of her privacy, I've removed removed certain sections of her response, as it contains some personal details that I'm not comfortable sharing with the world at large without her explicit permission. > Hello! Thanks for reaching out!❤ > In short, I've moved on. <removed> ...in November, I was hired by a > company that recently started using Rust. I'm very happily building > infrastructure there! > I'm simply not interested in spending more than 8 hours a day > programming. You couldn't even pay me to do it! My time is best spent > going on adventures with my beloved. > I'll still be active in the Rust ecosystem, but only insofar as the > company I work for is. We use winit on iOS, Android, and (to a limited > extent) macOS, so I'll work on those backends as needed. > Thank you for taking care of winit. I hope you're taking care of > yourself too; <removed>. I don't begrudge her for her decision, and others shouldn't either - I firmly believe that, as this is unpaid, volunteer work, everybody should have the right to move on when they decide they no longer have the time or will to contribute. The exact impliciation of this in regards to her status as maintainer is open to interpretation. I would argue that this means, should she in her work stumble upon an issue in any of her listed backends, she would be willing to submit PRs addressing those issues. However, it also means that she is not able to put in the time to be active as a maintainer on those platforms, or review PRs and issues for those platforms. On March 28th I responded to her email as follows: > Hey, thanks for responding. > <removed, personal details> > In the meanwhile, there are still a few loose ends from your time as > maintainer that I'd like to get cleaned up. It's okay if you aren't > going to be spending much time on Winit, but there's still a broad > assumption that you're able to review PRs for them and that doesn't seem > to be the case. Would you be able to do a couple things to ease the > transition to whoever next takes over the macOS, X11, and Android > backends? > 1) Submit a PR downgrading yourself from maintainer for macOS, X11, and > Android, so somebody else can more actively take them over. > 2) Post your WIP macOS backend for EL2.0 as well as the issues it > currently has, so whoever next maintains macOS can finish it. > Going forward, I'd like to reach out to the broader Rust community and > find more active maintainers so Winit can get to 1.0 and I can mostly > move on from it. I recieved no response to that email. On April 4th, I followed up on that email: > If you aren't able to act as a maintainer for Winit, and aren't able to > submit a PR updating your official status as maintainer to reflect > reality, would you mind if I submitted a PR removing you as maintainer? > That's not something I want to do since it's a bad image for me, a bad > image for Winit, and sets an extremely uncomfortable precedent, but I'd > like to start more aggressive outreach to ensure each backend is less > dependent on one specific person and I don't want to see new > contributors pinging you for help when you're unable to provide it. > If you don't reply by the 11th that's the path I'm going to take, but I > consider it the nuclear option and I want to avoid invoking it if at all > possible. Up to this date (April 13th), I have recieved no response. Given the amount of time I've given her to respond, as well as her lack of response, I believe we have the justification to remove her from the table. Should she show back up again, any clarifications on her status would be welcome, and she is welcome to submit a PR re-listing herself on the table with a more accurate description of her current contributor status. However, once we begin the contributor marketing push discussed in rust-windowing#830, I don't want new contributors to attempt to ask her questions on the macOS, X11, or Android backends when she isn't able to give a response. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- This PR also introduces HALL_OF_CHAMPIONS.md, which commends the efforts of former maintainers that have contributed greatly to the Winit project. This wasn't discussed previously, but I think it's important to recognize the people that brought us to where we are today. It currently lists @tomaka and @francesca64, as they are the two individuals I'm aware of that both deserve such recognition and no longer actively contribute to Winit, but if there's anybody I missed feel free to suggest them and a blurb describing their work.
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I'm glad to join winit team as a macOS maintainer! |
Winit needs more people actively working to improve it; the current crop of maintainers has been doing great work, but due to the nature of volunteer work said efforts aren't guaranteed and we don't have any contingency plans in the event that a platform maintainer stops being able to work on their platform. That is unacceptable, given Winit's foundational place in the Rust windowing, GUI, and gamedev ecosystems. I'd like to start a broader marketing push to get more people working on each of the backends (which I'm happy to helm), but there are a few questions I'd like to get resolved before getting started on that:
CONTRIBUTING.md, how should we list individuals that are able to contribute code to a platform, but don't necessarily have the time to maintain it? We don't have a role listed explicitly for doing that.I've got personal stances on most of those issues, but I'm going to reserve those for a separate comment so to keep the starting post relatively unbiased.
cc @tomaka @francesca64 @mitchmindtree @vberger @mtak- @zegentzy @ryanisaacg
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