-
Notifications
You must be signed in to change notification settings - Fork 29.9k
New issue
Have a question about this project? Sign up for a free GitHub account to open an issue and contact its maintainers and the community.
By clicking “Sign up for GitHub”, you agree to our terms of service and privacy statement. We’ll occasionally send you account related emails.
Already on GitHub? Sign in to your account
doc: remove personal pronoun guidance from style guide #19186
Conversation
@nodejs/documentation @gibfahn |
(Also: First time submitting a PR without having to list the subsystems at the bottom. A+! Will submit PRs again!) |
c56e26e
to
ec865a6
Compare
In order to facilitate a more formal voice, the style guide recommends avoiding personal pronouns. In practice, this results in lots of nits for our docs without actually improving them. There are lots of ways our docs can be improved. Making them more formal seems low value, especially for all the PR comments this guidance generates. So, remove that guidance from the style guide.
ec865a6
to
32b062e
Compare
There was a problem hiding this comment.
Choose a reason for hiding this comment
The reason will be displayed to describe this comment to others. Learn more.
I am firmly -1 on removing the restriction against using you
, your
, I
, and we
.
@jasnell Could you please provide a brief explanation why? |
Because I have a preference for the more formal voice in API documentation. The less formal voice is just fine for guides and tutorials. It adds nothing of value to API docs. |
Cross-posting from #18699 (comment)
|
If I'm in the minority in my opinion, then so be it. |
I agree with @jasnell here. |
I somewhat agree with @jasnell in that the informality that can result from acceptance of personal pronouns can lead to more verbose documentation that is harder to follow. I'm +-0 on this, but I think it'd be good if we could gather a little more community input on this. |
I'm a bit on the fence, I think sometimes avoiding you makes sense, but other times, like in https://nodejs.org/api/synopsis.html, we're still addressing the whole thing to the user, just carefully avoiding the word you. In @Trott 's original suggestion (#17977 (comment)) I'm not sure that actually improved the docs. As another example here:
does adding a So I guess IMHO sometimes (often?) avoiding you is good, it makes you reword the documentation so it describes the API rather than being a dialogue with the developer. But sometimes you are talking directly to the developer in the API docs, at which point avoiding it just means obfuscating that fact. @nodejs/collaborators , please weigh in! Also worth noting that only one of this and #19030 should land 😁 |
That's fair. I think rather than fully removing the text banning personal pronouns it might make sense to just reword it to suggest avoiding them and specifically avoiding conversation-style writing. |
@Qard That's how it's written already. It says "Generally avoid" rather than "Do not use" or something like that. So if that's what the consensus is (or if consensus can't be reached), then yeah, that's the way it's gonna be. :-D |
Ah, yeah. Missed that. 😅 |
* OK: "they", "their", "them", "folks", "people", "developers", "cats" | ||
* NOT OK: "his", "hers", "him", "her", "guys", "dudes" | ||
* Use gender-neutral pronouns and mass nouns. Non-comprehensive examples: | ||
* OK: "they", "their", "them", "folks", "people", "developers", "cats" |
There was a problem hiding this comment.
Choose a reason for hiding this comment
The reason will be displayed to describe this comment to others. Learn more.
How about we remove "cats" while we are here? I know, it is supposed to be funny, but it doesn't seem appropriate.
No strong opinion here, but I think I am in favor of keeping it a bit more formal.
This could be |
A valid counter-argument being that demanding formal writing style may discourage docs contributions from people who speak English as a second language and may not be as familiar with formal writing styles as a native speaker. |
There was a problem hiding this comment.
Choose a reason for hiding this comment
The reason will be displayed to describe this comment to others. Learn more.
I'm -1 on this one. A formal voice reads better in docs.
However, I can see why we want this change.
@@ -13,13 +13,9 @@ | |||
* American English spelling is preferred. "Capitalize" vs. "Capitalise", | |||
"color" vs. "colour", etc. | |||
* Use [serial commas][]. | |||
* Generally avoid personal pronouns in reference documentation ("I", "you", | |||
"we"). | |||
* Pronouns are acceptable in more colloquial documentation, like guides. |
There was a problem hiding this comment.
Choose a reason for hiding this comment
The reason will be displayed to describe this comment to others. Learn more.
I would replace Generally
with Try to
. It should not prevent something from landing, but it would be best fixed.
Google's style guide recommends to use "you" whenever possible. I personally prefer formal text. Although @Qard's point seems very valid to me. So, -0. |
There was a problem hiding this comment.
Choose a reason for hiding this comment
The reason will be displayed to describe this comment to others. Learn more.
"cats" seem out of place. Imagine a developer who does not speak English as first language (and even those who do). They would be very confused if documentation for some reason refers to "cats".
Fair point, but that's also true of too much passive voice. I would argue that the docs should be optimized for non-native speakers first, native speakers second. Pick what is simplest and concisest; the fewer vowels, the better. |
I'm surprised at suggestions that the formal voice results in more easy-to-understand documentation. I'm unaware of any evidence for this. I think the benefit of formal voice is more professional-sounding documentation. But more understandable? I'm skeptical. Taking the first instance I could find in https://nodejs.org/api/documentation.html, compare:
The second one is clearer, because the "please submit an issue..." stuff is what someone should do if they find an error, and that's clear at the outset of the sentence. By starting with "If errors are found in this documentation...", the meaning could at first be interpreted as "If the project finds an error in this documentation..." causing the reader to expect the sentence to be something more like "If errors are found in the documentation, corrections will be publish in an errata document available at...." or something like that. We could try to avoid that ambiguity in formal voice, but it doesn't result in an easier-to-understand formulation:
Is that really better than this?:
(Spoiler alert: No, it is not.) |
In order to facilitate a more formal voice, the style guide recommends
avoiding personal pronouns. In practice, this results in lots of nits
for our docs without actually improving them. There are lots of ways our
docs can be improved. Making them more formal seems low value,
especially for all the PR comments this guidance generates.
So, remove that guidance from the style guide.
Checklist